Curse

DarkSpirit · Jun 25, 2008, 07:12 AM // 07:12

I was experimenting with this build and it seems to work quite well in HM:

[build name="Command Paragon" prof=P/Me dom=3 spe=11+1+1 comma=8+1 lea=11+1][Aggressive Refrain]["Fall Back!"][Cry of Frustration][Cruel Spear]["Go for the Eyes!"][Anthem of Weariness][Anthem of Envy][Signet of Return][/build]

This command paragon has skills that synergize with minions and party members. Gfte increases the chance of critical strike, boosting minion damage and those of party members. "Fall Back!" helps to keep minions alive as they rush in to enage the enemies. "Leader's Comfort" synergizes with the number of minions within shout radius and grants the paragon a higher level of healing. The rest of his skills should be obvious.

[build name="Jagged MM" prof=N blo=3+1 death=12+1+3 sou=12+1][Jagged Bones][Animate Bone Horror][Animate Shambling Horror][Foul Feast][Infuse Condition][Death Nova][Dark Bond][Signet of Lost Souls][/build]
Variant:
[build name="Jagged MM" prof=N/Rt cha=10 death=12+1+3 sou=8+1][Jagged Bones][Animate Bone Horror][Animate Shambling Horror][Foul Feast][Infuse Condition][Death Nova][Splinter Weapon][Signet of Lost Souls][/build]

This build should be familiar by now. Condition handling and minion bombing with Dark Bond to protect the MM further. The variant version provides more offense.

[build name="Heal/Protect Necro" prof=N/Mo sou=9+1+1 hea=12 pro=9][Word of Healing][Signet of Rejuvenation][Patient Spirit][Spotless Mind][Dwayna's Sorrow][Signet of Lost Souls][Protective Spirit][Aegis][/build]

High level Dwayna's Sorrow for secondary healing from minion bombing. Patient Spirit and Spotless Mind, besides being useful healing and hex removing skills, also draw even more healing from EOTN Mhenlo's [[Dwayna's Kiss]. The rest should be self explainatory.

Remember to let her wield 40/40 healing weapon set.

Henchies used: Mhenlo, Zho, Aidan, Cynn or Herta.

phan · Jun 25, 2008, 07:18 AM // 07:18

Spank in a discord hero ;

maybe blood of the masters for getting the minions to their next fight ? [ I doubt fb is enough]

Get rid of the superior ;

Get rid of leaders comfort

graverobber2 · Jun 25, 2008, 07:22 AM // 07:22

trade [Signet of Rejuvenation] for [Dwayna's kiss] since you have a lot of enchants anyway

Ministry Of Peace · Jun 25, 2008, 07:27 AM // 07:27

Eh. I didn't think minions have attack skills?....

DarkSpirit · Jun 25, 2008, 07:29 AM // 07:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by phan

Spank in a discord hero ;

maybe blood of the masters for getting the minions to their next fight ? [ I doubt fb is enough]

Actually it is. Don't forget that if everyone is fully healed, the healers also help to keep the minions alive.

Quote:

Get rid of the superior ;

Superior for MM would be an exception. It is the difference between 9 level 16 bone horrors/level 14 jagged or 10 level 18 bone horrors/level 16 jagged. Anway, I leave that as an option for those who dont mind weaker and fewer minions for alittle more hp to the MM, although that would not be my personal preference.

Quote:

Get rid of leaders comfort

Leaders comfort also makes a big difference with minions around for a heal of 140hp every 8s. But you can swap it with [[Vicious attack] if you prefer a more offensive build.

DarkSpirit · Jun 25, 2008, 07:31 AM // 07:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ministry Of Peace

Eh. I didn't think minions have attack skills?....

Anthem of Envy is for party members, not for minions.

And Signet of Rejuvenation is useful for 0e healing for the situations where the MM has died before and soul reaping is low or in places with energy denial. Having said that, for more places, swapping it with [[Dwayna's Kiss] should be fine too.

You need at least 3 enchantments for Dwayna's Kiss to beat the healing from Signet of Rejuvenation (since heroes are usually either casting or attacking), but Dwayna's has a shorter recharge. Dwayna's also can not be self-targeted and costs 5e.

Cathode_Reborn · Jun 25, 2008, 08:11 AM // 08:11

Para's are probably the worst class to put a selfheal on. They should bring skills that benefit the the entire team so that the party and themselves won't need selfheals in the first place.

I'd drop SoLS from the nec.

EDIT: read somethin wrong.

DarkSpirit · Jun 25, 2008, 03:53 PM // 15:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cathode_Reborn

Para's are probably the worst class to put a selfheal on. They should bring skills that benefit the the entire team so that the party and themselves won't need selfheals in the first place.

I was thinking of having a tougher Paragon through synergy with minions. I have yet to see that Paragon die in HM, even when surrounded, and if he stays alive because of a single skill, the party continues to benefits from the rest of his shouts. That can't be such a bad thing.

In any case, I leave the option to drop Leader's Comfort for Vicious Attack for those who prefer stronger offense.

Quote:

I'd drop SoLS from the nec.

I am thinking if I should drop SoLS too and maybe replace that with [[Protective Spirit] since she never runs out of energy in most situations. With that, she can be set to defensive. Build updated. Thanks.

distilledwill · Jun 25, 2008, 05:09 PM // 17:09

Looks quite similar to a build Ive been working with the past few days:

[build prof=P/Me name="Cruel Spear Para" box Spearmastery=12+1+1 Command=8+1 leadership=9+1 dom=5][Cruel Spear][Blazing Spear][Cry Of Frustration]["Go For The Eyes!"][Anthem Of Flame]["Fall Back!"][Aggressive Refrain][Signet Of Return][/build]

[build prof=P/Me name="SoR Para" box Spearmastery=11+1+1 Motivation=9+1 leadership=9+1 dom=6][Spear Of Redemption][Harrier's Toss][Cry Of Frustration][Chorus Of Restoration][Song Of Restoration][Ballad Of Restoration][Aggressive Refrain][Signet Of Return][/build]

[build prof=N/Mo name="Jagged Blood" box Death=12+1+3 Soul=11+1 curses=6+1][Jagged Bones][Animate Bone Minions][Death Nova][Blood Of The Master][Enfeebling Blood][Signet Of Lost Souls][Infuse Condition][Foul Feast][/build]

Obviously hex control can be slipped onto the necro in place of BoTM if you're in a hex heavy area.

DarkSpirit · Jun 25, 2008, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by distilledwill

Looks quite similar to a build Ive been working with the past few days:

[build prof=P/Me name="Cruel Spear Para" box Spearmastery=12+1+1 Command=8+1 leadership=9+1 dom=5][Cruel Spear][Blazing Spear][Cry Of Frustration]["Go For The Eyes!"][Anthem Of Flame]["Fall Back!"][Aggressive Refrain][Signet Of Return][/build]

[build prof=P/Me name="SoR Para" box Spearmastery=11+1+1 Motivation=9+1 leadership=9+1 dom=6][Spear Of Redemption][Harrier's Toss][Cry Of Frustration][Chorus Of Restoration][Song Of Restoration][Ballad Of Restoration][Aggressive Refrain][Signet Of Return][/build]

[build prof=N/Mo name="Jagged Blood" box Death=12+1+3 Soul=11+1 curses=6+1][Jagged Bones][Animate Bone Minions][Death Nova][Blood Of The Master][Enfeebling Blood][Signet Of Lost Souls][Infuse Condition][Foul Feast][/build]

Obviously hex control can be slipped onto the necro in place of BoTM if you're in a hex heavy area.

I can see that working in some areas but you lose out on protection skills and blocking. You are also not exploiting your MM bomber with Dwayna's Sorrow, besides secondary heals DS also provides AoE cover enchant and synergizes with EOTN Mhenlo's Dwayna's Kiss to draw out more heals. And I like Anthem of Envy.

I dont really like to depend on the hench monks if I can help it. I have seen them let 2 of my heroes degen to death before (on a different build that uses Mhenlo and Lina) when they are still hexed after the fight. They stand there for about 5s and waited to be healed until they died.

I also prefer higher level minions now for the greater tanking ability and damage. The negative side is, it takes longer to build up the higher quality army and sometimes you have to wait around longer after the battle for the MM to create minions, but it is worth it.

I am currently thinking of letting my MM go secondary rit and equip him with Splinter Weapon for more AoE damage goodness!

-Lotus- · Jun 25, 2008, 06:13 PM // 18:13

this looks quite good. now to rip it up a little:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Gfte increases the chance of critical strike, boosting minion damage and those of party members.

minions dont do extra damage on a critical, they dont even get automatic maximum.

no superior rune on the MM. that makes him the automatic target for mobs. Id much rather have the 9 minions on my side than fight 10 of them.

that monk is going to fail so hard on energy... needs at least GolE for a hero monk.

DarkSpirit · Jun 25, 2008, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Lotus-

this looks quite good. now to rip it up a little:

minions dont do extra damage on a critical, they dont even get automatic maximum.

minion crits work differently to other crits, but they do more damage - the benefit from GFTE is quite noticable.

Quote:

no superior rune on the MM. that makes him the automatic target for mobs. Id much rather have the 9 minions on my side than fight 10 of them.

Minions are important to the party for offense as well as defense. You can go minor rune for lower level and fewer minions but I dont really like that because the party performance suffers as a result. Besides with dark bond (your MM only takes 25% of the damage), your MM can take quite a beating especially when used with higher level minions.

Quote:

that monk is going to fail so hard on energy... needs at least GolE for a hero monk.

That monk is a necro, with a MM in the party, no energy issues that I can see during battle.

Tyla · Jun 25, 2008, 06:25 PM // 18:25

What's keeping Aggressive Refrain up?

And self-heal is bad in most cases, unless you're a split off guy.

scythefromunder · Jun 25, 2008, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

What's keeping Aggressive Refrain up?

And self-heal is bad in most cases, unless you're a split off guy.

I think GFTE and Anthem of Envy.

DarkSpirit · Jun 25, 2008, 06:30 PM // 18:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

What's keeping Aggressive Refrain up?

And self-heal is bad in most cases, unless you're a split off guy.

Gfte?

Anyway, I may change Leader's Comfort to [[Never Surrender] which also synergizes with minions despite its description. I just hope it wouldn't affect the minion bombing in a negative way. I will try it out later today when I get back home.

Tyla · Jun 25, 2008, 06:33 PM // 18:33

I mean mid-battle.

scythefromunder · Jun 25, 2008, 06:39 PM // 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Gfte?

GftE = Go For the Eyes.

Turbobusa · Jun 25, 2008, 06:46 PM // 18:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Lotus-

no superior rune on the MM. that makes him the automatic target for mobs. Id much rather have the 9 minions on my side than fight 10 of them.

I'd rather having 10 and sac less with BotM.
If DP is a problem, PS is the way to go.

Mitchel · Jun 25, 2008, 06:51 PM // 18:51

Do Heroes know how to target Dwayna's Sorrow? Been wondering that for a while myself.

War My Guild · Jun 25, 2008, 06:55 PM // 18:55

Methinks, that on the Monk, [signet of lost souls] should be added instead of [spotless mind]. Having said that, drop [animate shambling horror] for [remove hex].

Of course, that would change in hex heavy areas, but the signet on the monk would help with energy.

Oh, and if you're running the variant MM with [putrid bile], then why not switch the attributes so the MM can take [enfeebling blood] and the para can take something else in that slot(+6 free curse attribute points). The way the para is, the attributes are a little too spread for my liking and I've never seen anyone run any curse on a para.

Quote:

Do Heroes know how to target Dwayna's Sorrow? Been wondering that for a while myself.

They use it well thanks to a recent update to the AI for the skill.